District 6 Wrestling Forum

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if I feel that your comments are derogatory or just plain idiotic, you will be banned from this site without warning. This is NOT why we have this forum and if the problems continue, the site will simply shut down.

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public vs. private

Anyone else notice that the Southwest AA and Northwest AAA regional titles were won by Catholic schools? It's starting to look like the PIAA basketball tournaments. And that's not a pretty picture.

Re: public vs. private

Truly honored to have you weigh in on this subject. Not often a guy who has been inducted into half a dozen sports and journalism halls of fame both in and out of PA enters the discussion.

Understand your point for sure but I will tell you that the boys at Best Way Pizza just off I99 Exit 3 only consider schools with defined geographic borders for team title honors. We don’t care if the Boalsburg Pikers claimed 4-5-6 individual region titles in SWAA or the Ancient Ivy Covered Cathedral on West 9th Street did the same thing in NWAAA. We recognize those individual kids worked really hard and are great talent. They deserve the right to win individual titles but should be discounted in any team races. Just like for example when tiny Clarion claimed 3 of the 10 NCAA D1 titles in 1973— including Wade Schalles. But Clarion did not have their points count in the D1 team race because they were D2.

Not down here in Bedford County, we apply that same principle as such to your private vs public situation. As such, just like Paterno declaring his 1973 team national champs when the system said otherwise—- the distinguished panel of LHAC rooting Alum Bankers declared the 2019 SWAA team champ to be Chestnut Ridge with Forest Hills at #2; and the NWAAA champs to be Mifflin County and runner ups to be Bellefonte. We really hope the boys at the Philipsburg Elks vote the same way.

Re: public vs. private

And the public schools don't recruit

Re: public vs. private

True with a few exceptions most notably in D11 for the past 50 years and in State College 15-20 years ago

Re: public vs. private

Alum banker, your style seems familiar.

Re: public vs. private

Just out of curiosity, what exactly is the recruiting process at these schools. And from my knowledge “the Boalsburg pike mat club” has had the district 6 committee investigate for recruiting, and surprisingly they found no evidence of recruiting and everything was legit. There was actually a vote on one particular case where the vote was 10 votes to zero stating there was no recruiting happening.

Re: public vs. private

I'm guessing most of you are not fans of Division 1 wrestling or Penn State. Many Penn State starters come from private schools or transferred schools and more than half of the D1 National champions last year also transferred schools in high school. Spencer Lee and Devin Brown who were both state champions were not from Franklin Regional. Zain Rutherford transferred to Benton. David Taylor, Ed Ruth and Mark Hall all either moved or transferred. I didn't see Chestnut Ridge refuse Kaiden Cassidy last year or the two brothers from Hyndman this year . I've known many kids that moved into Reynolds School District and Burrell has a kid paying tuition from another school district on their team. Forest Hills has a couple of kids in elementary and Junior High that moved into their school district. I'm sure it was not for a better education. High School is just a stepping stone for bigger and better things in life. I feel bad for those of you that peaked in high school and those were the best days of your life. It shouldn't be that way. I tell my kids that if the best part of your life was high school then you did something wrong. The sad part is that the adults care more about this then the kids do. Unfortunately adults ruin most youth and high school sports.

Re: public vs. private

Don't be so naive anon and please don't insult our intelligence saying it doesn't happen. Or let me guess, you are one of those people who think OJ is innocent because he was acquitted? The only question is if they are caught before the money runs out and they fold the program. The biggest bet may be which program is caught first, St. Joe's or forest hills! Chew on that one for a while........

Re: public vs. private

Wrestling Alum -

You are saying that since good wrestlers transfer and want to get better, then it is all right if everyone continues to do it. You are saying that since college is their end game, then it is all right. That argument is wrong on so many levels and simply doesn't make sense.

Just because others are doing or have done it does not make it right. If someone wants to go to a prep school, that is more than all right. If St. Joe's or Erie Prep wants to compete with Wyoming Seminary and Blair Academy at National Prep tournaments, go ahead. Most people have a problem with Private schools recruiting kids from other programs. Can public schools do that? No. Private Schools have no borders. They get the best kids from somewhat local programs to wrestle together and go to the best tournaments with good coaches. Fair? Think not. Look what Bethlehem Catholic has done. Look what Saint Joe's has done. Look what Erie Cathedral Prep has done. These teams are ruining high school wrestling. This is not club wrestling. A kid wrestles in a local community from elementary to Junior High to Varsity and then leaves. Fair? Guess again. There is no argument.

Don't blame the player, blame the game. I hope AlumBanker is right and Scott Conklin passes the piece of legislation which would even the playing field and separate public and private in PIAA. The time is long past.

As for wrestlers moving and transferring into other public schools, I hope there is a better way to prevent this from happening. It definitely does happen.

Re: public vs. private

Only problem with Schools like Saint Joseph’s moving to preps is then they will be competing with schools who are allowed to board kids when they only have around 200 kids.

I don’t see any issue with them competing in PIAA against public schools, however, I don’t really care for them winning team titles as well. At the same time, they have 8 kids I would assume that those kids didn’t go to Saint Joes to win team titles. I like how they didn’t compete in district duals and I feel all private schools should do the same.

Being very relevant in D3 and talking to people from Mcdevit, the move to private school move allowed their kids to get better partners, more exposure to colleges, tougher schedule, and better education.

It can be unfair for these teams to compete in a team race. I believe there should be a public and private team race, however I see no problem with the competition for individuals.

So, I’m happy to call Miff Co and Chesnut Ridge Regional Champs.

Re: public vs. private

Superb Post—-

If run for election as Executive Director of the PIAA, I will guarantee that you will carry Bedford County with a massive landslide victory.

Truly one of the best statements I have ever seen on here and of course posted by someone outside of D6.

Great work. You need to get this on PENN LIVE and to some WPIAL publications. Also send it to Pennsylvania Wrestling Magazine and we will see if they have the strength to publish it

Re: public vs. private

I love how everybody has ignored the comment about Public Schools doing the same thing and kids transferring. By only picking on the private schools it really shows your true colors and your agenda.

Re: public vs. private

It is tough, a lot of public schools have more transfers than people think. It is just not as egregious since they are public schools. I don't think there really is anything you can do about it, since you can't really prove it is purely for wrestling reasons.

As for private schools, it sure doesn't seem to be a problem if they are only competing at the individual level. The whole tough thing is the lack of an even playing field and taking away from a schools homegrown program. Wouldn't everyone love to have a better education with better class size, better workout partners, top notch classes, better exposure, and more? Of course. Unfortunately only some people can afford this opportunity. It only favors the rich kids. That is not an even playing field.

As for plucking homegrown kids and having them go to a private school, that is what really gets people going. Take Bellefontr for instance. If they had everyone on their roster this year from St. Joe's and other places, they could have made a deep run into the state tournament it seems. But for someone that has been trained and improved from numerous volunteer elementary Jr. High coaches in the program, it is then tough to see that wrestler paraded around at the Varsity level for a couple of years at another private school instead of helping their Varsity program.

Re: public vs. private

I'm sure if those kids who transfer to private schools were happy with their Public School education and coaching they would not leave. As far as "homegrown" I really don't like that term. Yes that does apply to the average kid who only wrestles three months of the year. Any high-level wrestler is really not homegrown by their coaching staff. They wrestle more in the offseason than they do in the three months of the regular season and are coached by usually their Club coach and not their high school or Junior High coach. Not many High School coaches have practice all year round. So the term homegrown is very misleading. As far as not being fair a that some people can afford private schools that's pretty much how life is. Some kids have more opportunities because their parents are willing to sacrifice and take them to tournaments all over the country. I know many people who don't make a lot of money but they sacrifice for their kids and get them the training and tourneys they need to be successful.

Re: public vs. private

Without the “average” kid or “average” wrestler, high school wrestling would or will someday cease to exist.

Re: public vs. private

2 years ago my son went to about 12 tournaments over the summer and the High School and Junior High coaches did not attend one of them. His Club coach was there for most of them. We did see Private School coaches there coaching their kids. We saw the Becca coach at some of these tourneys and they were 3 to 4 hours away from home and we were only less than a half an hour away but no coaches . Maybe that's when these kids see and the dedication from some of the Private School coaches and start thinking maybe that's what I need. Just a thought.

Re: public vs. private

Wrestling alum I am glad you made this arguement about wrestling/sports? I thought transferring was all about academic. Here are a few questions for you to ponder: Your name is interesting, did you happen to wrestle? Or were you one of those guys who quit or didn't compete and trying to live through their sons? Not to stereotype but this is often the case with the private school wrestlers. have you attended an event just because? Probably not, only there if your son/daughter was there, right? How much per month do you pay your club coach? Does he or she do anything for free? I am guessing you are probably paying those coaches a lot more than any high school coach would make yet maybe practice 1-2 days a week. Do you know that those private schools and club coaches are the same thing often time so really they are getting paid twice. Through school and the club. Wasn't Blackdog coach & SJCA Head Coach the same person? Just using Centre County, who were the most recent state champions (we will keep it simple instead of placewinners) We will use 2000s - I might be missing some but I have Port, Galloway, Bosak, Maney, Taylor, Wright, Altons, I might be missing some but please note what have in common. Since college was mentioned, too my knowledge Mitchell Port, Steve Bosak (NCAA Champion), Quentin Wright (NCAA Champion), Alton , again might be missing some in there, but again please note what they have in common. Bottom line is this, people make any excuse they want and try to justify their point of view coaches, academics, etc. For example, Barry Bonds setting a home run record taking steroids. His and other excuses, well everyone was doing it. We will see if he ever makes the Hall of Fame. If a wrestler wants to be great, they can achieve it any where. I believe Chance Martstellar was a 4 time State Champion at a small public school and now an All-American. Kolat same thing, small high school and national champion at small school. Again, success cane be attained where you want it to be. Blaming coaches, schools, etc. are excuses, which only sets the precedent for blame the rest of their lives. Boss is mean, I want a $20 minimum wage, etc. Wrestling is not in a good spot long term and the direction seems to be heading with the likes of gymnastics or other popular club sports where the concern is more internal and not big picture. For example, what is the attendance like at these club events? Not very good, usually just wrestlers and a few parents.